Trap Valentina license time limit - where is thedocumentationhypelinks - LOL, can we take a good ribbing?

[Barry G. Sumpter]

-----Original Message-----
From: valentina-bounces at lists.macserve.net
[mailto:valentina-bounces at lists.macserve.net] On Behalf Of Thorsten Hohage
Sent: Saturday, 7 July 2007 7:15 AM
To: Valentina Developers
Subject: Re: Trap Valentina license time limit - where is
thedocumentationhypelinks - LOL, can we take a good ribbing?

Hi Barry,

I reply again and try to shed some light on some of your points. But  
keep in mind, I'm a developer and "Valentina USER" like you, so I'm  
no Valentina authority or expert. Perhaps you forced to wait until  
Ruslan is back, or some other staff jumps in.

Again, we've missed my point.  
A quick reply does NOT equate to a valid answer.
I don't expect users to be an expert just a contributor as best they can.

I'm asking for user contributions because the support from the quick
paradigm replies do not answer my questions.  
So I'm not sure why we keep mentioning to ask paradigm support.


On 2007-07-06, at 22:21, Barry G. Sumpter wrote:

> Your replys read like you have no problem with understanding.

I didn't have any "getting started" problems, but of course I've some  
questions left, because of the difference between between mySQL and  
Valentina. But I try to find out as much as possible and then asked a  
specific question.

???

> At least enough to understand that I'm an angry user.
I try it, but it's hard.

???

> But only as far as the frustration with the documentation and  
> support which
> I feel I have a right to express.
Better expressing it here, than leaving Valentina behind and telling  
all over the internet how bad it is ;-)

Yes, well regrettably I did put it down because I wasn't making any headway.
I have an absolutely brilliant boss who has shown incredible patience with
my huge learning curve and has encouraged me to return to Valentina.


What I didn't understand is your issue with the support! IMHO the  
support given on this list and in private mails is far better then  
any support I got form any other db-vendor, far better, far quicker  
and in cases the fix was nearly done immediately if necessary. But I  
understand, that there is a different between paying VDN-members,  
"common" users and nothing paid at all free community server users.

No problem with you writing this.  I've had better experience simple because
there is a decent search engine where people have already answered in
detail.

Have you seen all the different license options and versions?
Who could keep up with all that?
Who could have the presence of mind to deliver better support to one than
the other?  No matter who is paid or not.  
Just in case it does matter we are fully licensed ADK for RB users. 
No, I'm not expected better support because we have paid licenses.

> If you missed that then that's regrettable as I'm hoping to  
> encourage other
> users to contribute more.
Contribute to the list of missing documentation? Contribute to the  
documentation? Contribute to this topic and to solve your issues?

Yes, Yes, and Yes. And any more ideas or constructive suggestions that could
benefit anyone from a single user to the entire group of the contributing or
non-contribution community.


> I'm looking for coding support.  i.e. exact hyperlinks or responses  
> for
> better coding examples etc.
IMHO there is a difference between "coding support" and a friendly  
and helpful mailing-list. The later are for helping with "issues" in  
mutuality, the first is more a on-site-consultancy via email.

Happy to disagree there.  You get it where you can.  Who has time to
differentiate?


> I've done my considerable due diligence and have scanned all  
> documents and
> web sites pertaining to Valentina.  None contained the content  
> requested.
> Including the links you posted.
I must admit you're right here, the REAL topic or better keyword is  
not included in any documentation, samples, ... anything from Valentina.

???


But IMHO this is the art of software development - getting everything  
you're able to get and improvise over the missing part. But of course  
this may be time consuming and perhaps missleading.

Yes, especially if the topic simply does not exist.


> If you think I'm flaming I should show you some of my emails and posts
> received from my users.  They'll melt your ears off.  Lol
But why starts your users flaming you? Do you deploy an app using a  
demo licence?????? Do you make any other mistakes?

There is life outside of Valentina.
I've been supporting users of various hardware and software issues for the
last 6 years now.  Some don't need an excuse.  Others have a very valid one.
I have a policy of deleting flames straight away and just ask them to send
again in a properly worded way and I'll get right back to them.  They learn
very quickly that the 30 minutes it took to write the flame was wasted time.
I have a 20 minute response time.  i.e. message received, I'm investigating
right now, and have an answer shortly.

> Any chance on elaborating on the off list behind the scenes help?
I'm not sure about. If I'm going to provide some help and thoughts,  
and this for free, then the answer should go to the public mailing- 
list. Sometimes, really some rare times, I went a step further and  
provide help of-list i. e. when Bart got his crashes in the night  
before an important presentation.

But on the other side, I made my money in two areas selling custom  
software apps and doing developer consultancy. Don't get it in the  
wrong way, I didn't understand this or the RB-, or the OMNIS or any  
other mailing-list as a marketing channel for my business, and I'm  
willing to provide help for free, as I request help when I hit the wall.

If you need more assistance then you should talk with Valentina staff  
about support. While Ruslan is on holiday, you should perhaps get in  
contact with Lynn about who, when and how much or wait if any other  
technician is jumping in.

Yeah I'm the same way.  I contribute best I can and expect decent replies
from other users when I need assistance.


> I think I've been very clear making my point regarding the need for  
> better
> documentation and news list replies.
Yes - absolutely clear - at least for me.

Cool.

> Did you read my list of queries?  (besides the general time limit  
> license?)
I must admit NO! But I just rescanned my inbox and I didn't find a  
precise list of (technical) questions?


... documentation hyperlinks regarding this exception:
ERR_INTERNAL_DEMO_TIMEOUT (coding)

... documentation hyperlinks regarding (coding) license time out issues

... documentation hyperlinks regarding kernel_errors.xml (coding)

... documentation hyperlinks regarding serial numbers 
from v1.1 NOT working in v3.1 - (discussion or coding)



> Anyway still hoping to encourage other to participate.


I'm not sure if these lengthy emails with this even longer subject is  
the propitiate way to encourage anybody.

It's OK.  You don't have to be sure.  I am.

We can agree to dis-agree and be the better off for it and continue to
contribute in a positive constructive way.

Again, you don't have to be right or an expert or quick.
I'm just asking other users to participate as best they can.  
(preferably with coding example attached)

All the best to everyone,
     Barry G. Sumpter

regards

Thorsten Hohage
--
objectmanufactur.com - Hamburg,Germany


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